IEEE Rail Transit Vehicle Interface Standards Committee

 

WG9 STANDARD P1544

TRANSIT COMMUNICATIONS INTERFACE PROFILES FOR RAIL APPLICATIONS

 

Meeting 13, January 17, 2001, 10:00 AM

LTK Engineering Services

100 West Butler Avenue

Ambler, PA 19002

(215) 542-0700

 

Combined Agenda and Minutes

Attendees:

 

Name

Company

Phone

E-Mail

Ken Kelsey

Adtranz

(412) 655-5311

kenneth.p.kelsey@us.adtranz.com

Pierre Zuber

Adtranz

(412) 655-5479

pierre.a.zuber@us.adtranz.com

Dave Phelps

APTA

(202) 898-4085

dphelps@apta.com

Jerry Graham

ARINC

(410) 266-4086

jgraham@arinc.com

Mike Izbicki

ARINC

(603) 493-0536

mizbicki@arinc.com

Karl Berger

Berger Engineering

(703) 803-7917

kwb@bergerengineering.com

Christian Girard

Bombardier

(450) 441-2020

cgirard@transport.bombardier.com

Venkat Pindiprolu

FTA

(202) 366-8061

venkat.pindiprolu@fta.dot.gov

Fred Woolsey

LTK

(215) 641-8865

fwoolsey@ltk.com

Jim Lyke

LTK

(215) 641-8871

jlyke@ltk.com

Greg Neff

Microsym

(416) 293-8263

greg@microsym.com

John Squitieri

NJ Transit

(973) 491-8265

jsquitieri@njtransit.com

Mark Hooley

NJ Transit

(201) 955-5993

mhooley@njtransit.com

Ramdane Benferhat

NYCT

(718) 694-4433

ceents22rb@aol.com

Peter Lutz

Siemens

+49 91 31 728254

peter.lutz@ts.siemens.de

Chris Holliday

STV

(215) 832-3520

hollidcj@stvinc.com

Tom McGean

TJMPE

(757) 789-5166

t.j.mcgean@ieee.org

 

10:00-10:15 AM

·                    Introductions, meeting purpose

10:15-10:45 AM

·                    Old business (action items from last meeting)

o                    Contact Tom Sullivan regarding LonWorld documents online (Fred Woolsey)- According to Tom Sullivan, documents are not allowed to be published on the RTVISC web site.

Greg Neff indicated, however, that it is allowable to link to a paper on a presenter’s own web site.

o                    Send copy of IEEE “cleanroom” gateway proposal to Isabelle Cornelus (Fred Woolsey)- Done.

o                    ALSTOM to determine the extent to which they can cooperate with the “cleanroom” implementation on Comet 5 (Isabelle Cornelus).

o                    Make UIC 556 available on WG9 FTP site (Fred Woolsey)- Done.

o                    Put IEEE WG9 discussion group back online (Fred Woolsey)- Done.

o                    Make comments document available online (Fred Woolsey)- Done.

o                    E-mail WG9 list with notification that info is online (Fred Woolsey)- Done.

o                    Determine suitability of data elements from TCN standpoint (Pierre Zuber).

Pierre Zuber recommended that final assessment of the data elements be deferred until the NJ Transit data elements are defined.

Greg Neff brought up the discrepancy between the IEEE 1475 tractive element definition and the UIC 556 definition.  This led to a discussion of compatibility between the data elements under development and the existing IEEE standards.  Dave Phelps pointed out that any standard represents the group’s understanding of best practice at the time of development, and that changes in technology occur so rapidly that changes are to be expected.

o                    Determine suitability of data elements from LonMark standpoint (Jeremy Roberts).

10:45 AM-12:00 PM

·                    Discussion of Recent Developments

o                    NJ Transit Comet 5-ALP-46 WTB interoperability and its impact on/relevance to IEEE 1544- Fred Woolsey, Tom McGean, Chris Holliday

Chris Holliday provided an overview of the NJ Transit vehicle programs.  Essentially, trainline data elements will be taken from UIC 556, with US-specific data elements transmitted using the reserve areas of the UIC telegrams.  The result of this development will be made available in the form of interoperability documentation.

NJ Transit feels it is highly desirable for the IEEE to be involved in reviewing the developing data elements; however, the NJ Transit programs schedule provide some constraints on the time available for IEEE involvement.

Tom McGean pointed out that the IEEE process provides some additional constraints.  Pierre Zuber offered the suggestion that the NJ Transit work be taken as the initial standard, with enough flexibility to allow changes for those elements that are relevant only to NJT.  Tom McGean pointed out again that an IEEE standard is a consensus standard requiring approval, and that all negative ballots must be considered and addressed.  NJ Transit expressed their desire to work with the IEEE to facilitate development of this consensus standard.

Venkat Pindiprolu asked NJ Transit for their understanding and definition of interoperability.  NJ Transit stated that the primary concern was interoperability and interchangeability of vehicles within trainsets.  Tom McGean pointed out that this agrees with the direction WG9 has taken.

There was then some discussion of work that has already been done by the working group, in particular the focus on those data elements needed for train operation.

Tom McGean stressed the importance of looking at the work done by Adtranz and comparing it with the work already done by this working group.  NJ Transit emphasized that any work done was done with IEEE compliance in view.  Taking the approach of using UIC 556 as the basis for the flow down to LonWorks appears to be the simpler approach.

Greg Neff raised the question regarding the approach to data element development and the data definition flow from TCN to LonWorks.  Fred Woolsey moved that the working group use IEEE 1473 together with UIC 556, modified for North American practice, as the basis for data element development, and that this should be the basis for the flow of data from WTB to LonWorks.  Dave Phelps raised a discussion point, however, that the motion should not ignore work done on IEEE 1475 and R142.  The motion was recast as follows:

Moved: “The working group shall use IEEE 1473 together with UIC 556, modified for North American practice, as the basis for data element development, and this shall be the basis for the flow of data between WTB and LonWorks.  In addition, the work shall consider pre-existing standards, including IEEE 1475, in data element development, and shall identify discrepancies wherever practical.  The work of WG9 will continue to focus on process data interoperability between basic operating units.”

The motion was voted on as written and passed unanimously.

(Lunch)

Fred Woolsey presented an overview of the Adtranz network architecture and remote diagnostic system.

1:00-3:00 PM

o                    Cleanroom implementation of TCN-Lon gateway on Comet 5-ALP-46- Fred Woolsey, Tom McGean, Jerry Graham

Tom McGean explained that the NJ Transit program does not fulfill two of the original goals of the gateway proposal: to provide a direct hardware gateway between WTB and LonWorks, and to have a firm unfamiliar with TCN do the TCN implementation.  He then explained that Jerry Graham of ARINC would be heading WG1, which will be taking a fresh look at networking protocols.

Tom McGean asked NJ Transit for ideas on how the IEEE could help their programs.  In particular, it was suggested that a list of deliverables and design reviews, with scheduled dates, would be useful in coordinating IEEE participation.  NJ Transit took action to provide this schedule.

Action: NJ Transit to provide schedule to facilitate IEEE participation.

Greg Neff suggested that it would be beneficial to work along with Adtranz and ALSTOM rather than waiting for them to produce final documents.  He also raised the concern that LonMark may be directing ALSTOM differently than decided at this meeting.

Action: Fred Woolsey to contact Jeremy Roberts to inform him of the direction taken in the motion voted on (above).

There was additional discussion of the hardware implementation of the gateway.  It was agreed that the NJ Transit Comet V program was not necessarily the proper basis for this.

Tom McGean raised the question of what IEEE WG1 could do to help make TCN an open standard in the sense that suppliers in North America have familiarity with it.  This was discussed at length.

Finally, it was agreed that the gateway implementation on NJ Transit would be useful as a basis for developing a performance specification for a standard gateway, but would not fulfill the original goals of the cleanroom proposal.

Fred Woolsey stated that there was some concern over statements made concerning the openness of the NJ Transit implementation, and clarified that the documentation to be provided to NJ Transit is intended to be sufficient to allow any other carbuilder to provide equipment interoperable with the equipment now being procured.  It was finally agreed that, between IEEE 1544 (which will incorporate the NJ Transit information) and 1473, there will be enough information in the standards to make the implementation open.

There was discussion of doing a single-step gateway implementation on NJ Transit equipment, perhaps on Comet II overhaul cars.  NJ Transit was open to this and stated that they would discuss this possibility internally.

Action: Jerry Graham and Fred Woolsey to collaborate on developing a scope of work and estimated cost for a one-step gateway implementation on NJ Transit equipment as a test bed (due COB 1/23/01).  Send to Dave Phelps and Venkat Pindiprolu.

Action: NJ Transit to inform the working group regarding possibility of using NJ Transit equipment for single-step gateway reference implementation.

Venkat Pindiprolu requested a two-page write-up describing this proposal.

Action: Tom McGean to provide a write-up for the “new” gateway proposal.

o                    NJ Transit Comet 5-ALP-46 TWC interoperability- Fred Woolsey, Tom McGean

Tom McGean requested Adtranz to make a presentation at the next full committee meeting of their NJ Transit TWC proposal.

Action: Adtranz to determine whether they can make a presentation at the RTVISC meeting.

o                    New working group for TWC protocol- Tom McGean

This will be discussed at the RTVISC meeting as well.

o                    LonMark Profile developments- Greg Neff, Jeremy Roberts, Jim Lyke, Tom Sullivan (discussed previously)

o                    ALSTOM progress on LonMark interoperability- Isabelle Cornelus (not discussed)

(The following section was not covered)======================

·                    Data Element Review

o                    Database review- Fred Woolsey

o                    Doors- Isabelle Cornelus

o                    Propulsion- Dave Phelps, Pierre Zuber

o                    Others- All

====================================================

3:00-4:15 PM

·                    Next activities

o                    Additional review action and assignment of responsibility- Fred Woolsey, Tom McGean

Action: Fred Woolsey to update draft list of data elements in IEEE draft standard format and make available by 1/31/01.

Venkat Pindiprolu suggested that “safety critical” data elements be identified as such.

Tom McGean stressed the importance of coordinating work with Adtranz and ALSTOM to ensure meaningful participation by the IEEE with the NJ Transit work.  For this to happen, there needs to be open sharing of information as it develops.

o                    Draft standard- Fred Woolsey, Tom McGean

It was agreed that the data element information should be put in the form of a draft standard.

o                    Entering elements in ITS data registry- Tom McGean, Fred Woolsey

It was agreed that this needed to be done, but a good deal further down the road.

o                    Diagnostic data elements

Dave Phelps stated that the proper place for generating these elements is WG3.  If WG3 defines the need for an element and that element already exists, they can use it.  If it does not exist, it would be created and WG9 would “add it to the list.”  WG9 would be the repository for these elements.

o                    Intra-car interoperability (see above)

o                    Schedule- Fred Woolsey, Tom McGean

4:15-5:30 PM

·                    Wrap-up

·                    New Business

·                    Meeting Time and Place, next meeting

Wednesday, March 14, 2001
9:00 AM
APTA Headquarters
Washington, DC

·                    Adjourn